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[JetJaguar2000]

^ Very well put Vander. And sorry Jet about the dismissal from Ningal. Oh, and I haven't taken any time off work for this game or for that coordinated strike against you. Hell, I did that while tending a brushfire. This is the type of game where you can do that, which is why I love it so much. And I'm totally with Vander on the fact that if I buy a game, I want to be able to play as much as I like. You limit me, I'm out. And I completely disagree with you that you HAVE to play this game 100 hours a week to be successful. If you were smart about your defenses, your HW and Colony planets wouldn't have been easy pickings. I only lost 63 battleships taking your Homeworld. Next time you play, I suggest loading up your Colonies and HW with multiple Orbital Defense Systems, ESPECIALLY if you don't plan on playing very often throughout the day.

On Irkalla I might sign in once every 4 days, just to make sure my Research Queue is still operating properly. Yes, I've lost a bunch of outposts because of it, but my core worlds are fine and I'm just waiting for Interstellar Commerce to finishing researching.

It's all about how you approach the game and what you expect to get out of it. If you expect to win, you and a lot of other people are going to be sorely disappointed. If you're playing because you enjoy this type of game, you're going to be happy no matter what happens.

I get that you are a fanboy of this game, but give me a break. You seriously think I don't understand the concept of defending my territory? It's true, I was "dismissed" because I had crappy defenses. That was mainly because I was focusing on RO collection and gambling that you wouldn't betray me, both of which were obviously bad choices.

But regardless, with you being a Trader and playing more than I did, I never would have had a chance even if we weren't allies. There was no "coordinated strike." You just built a bigger fleet than I could, sent it directly to my homeworld, and it's Game Over for JetJaguar2000. You aren't really that naive to think that makes for a balanced, fun game, are you? There isn't a number of defenses I could build that you wouldn't be able to overrun. (On a side note, another gameplay fail: being able to have your homeworld knocked out in one strike, regardless of how big your empire is otherwise, but that's another discussion)

The game right now is not a game. It's purely a race to see who can build a colony-killing fleet first. There are no interesting strategic or tactical decisions that lead up to this outcome, it is entirely about claiming as many worlds as possible, which means meticulously ordering probes and outpost ships around, which is boring and caters to the guy willing to sit there and do that.

Once again, I am willing to concede that maybe this game is not for me, if that's what it's about. At first I thought this game was going to blow Starbase Orion out of the water, but now that I've played through a couple of games, I realize it is much less strategic and interesting. That's a shame, because it seemed to have a lot more promise than that.

[VanderLegion]

Once again, I am willing to concede that maybe this game is not for me, if that's what it's about. At first I thought this game was going to blow Starbase Orion out of the water, but now that I've played through a couple of games, I realize it is much less strategic and interesting. That's a shame, because it seemed to have a lot more promise than that.

I never expected it to do that, they're pretty much two completely different types of games, both 4X but vastly different implementations. Also, I'm too big a fanboy of SO for anything else to replace it without being SPECTACULARLY good (and a similar style game, or else I'd probably just play both, as I am with Empire). I still think Empire has the promise to be a really good game, but it does still need some work...

[mischmi]

The game right now is not a game. It's purely a race to see who can build a colony-killing fleet first. There are no interesting strategic or tactical decisions that lead up to this outcome, it is entirely about claiming as many worlds as possible, which means meticulously ordering probes and outpost ships around, which is boring and caters to the guy willing to sit there and do that.

Im with you. Nothing interesting happens. Just building a big fleet researching an claiming homeworlds. got 2 in mammetum and owning most of the sector. now im just waiting for research to finish. no interaction with other players. empty channels. its getting boring after one month as nothing really happens. maybe ill try another server but i will not buy another month this time. ill give it another try in some months

[SG7]

The game right now is not a game. It's purely a race to see who can build a colony-killing fleet first. There are no interesting strategic or tactical decisions that lead up to this outcome, it is entirely about claiming as many worlds as possible, which means meticulously ordering probes and outpost ships around, which is boring and caters to the guy willing to sit there and do that.
Once again, I am willing to concede that maybe this game is not for me

That is very simplistic, shallow and ultimately false view of the game. The game is a race for win but not who can build a colony-killing fleet first. Limited resources, limited number of objects which one can build force smart player to optimize his decisions along the path to the victory. Just building a colony-killing fleet will not guarantee you the win. Do you have to use probes? Yes! Should you expand if you can? Yes!
Is that boring? Is working 8 hours per day boring? Is driving the same car for 5 years boring? Is raising your children for 18 years boring? Is having same parents for 50 years boring? It may be… for some people but not for all.

[ChickenHawk07]

That is very simplistic, shallow and ultimately false view of the game. The game is a race for win but not who can build a colony-killing fleet first. Limited resources, limited number of objects which one can build force smart player to optimize his decisions along the path to the victory. Just building a colony-killing fleet will not guarantee you the win. Do you have to use probes? Yes! Should you expand if you can? Yes!
Is that boring? Is working 8 hours per day boring? Is driving the same car for 5 years boring? Is raising your children for 18 years boring? Is having same parents for 50 years boring? It may be… for some people but not for all.

Well said! And true.

[JetJaguar2000]

This is the last statement I'm going to make about the game here:

I think your view of the game is distorted by the amount of time you have put in to it. Like ChickenHawk, you have invented a narrative about how the game plays that is far more nuanced than the game itself.

You are practically making my argument for me. Because of the timed nature of everything you can do in the game, you can more or less plan out your entire strategy before the game even starts. The only variables introduced by the game itself are your initial proximity to resources, which arguably just averages out over the course of a game, and whether you start near one of the other aggressive players. The latter is rendered pretty meaningless too, because of the "winner take all" nature of combat and colony killing. Either you build the bigger fleet and you win, or they do and they win.

I doubt there has been any protracted wars between the "serious" players. I think you guys play with this mentality of avoiding all conflicts you aren't guaranteed to win, on the basis of "mutually assured destruction." I think you would argue that there isn't actually anything worth fighting for in the game; the trick, as Raven posted all those weeks ago, is to just claim as much space as possible without pissing any other "serious" players off. The clueless chaff, like myself, you can just steamroll in to oblivion. I know that I have evidently wasted time in pointless battles when I should have just been looking for more empty systems.

Anyways, again, I concede that this game might not be for me. The experience is so homogenous that it becomes frankly boring. There are not enough interesting variables. It's like playing a spreadsheet. I think you will find that most players will come to the same conclusions. We're one month in, and the game has already been "min/maxed" by you and a handful of others. I really think most people are not interested in playing like that, but time will tell.